ruote log_2010-08-19

2010-08-19 12:18:44 utc tosch_le hello jmettraux!
2010-08-19 12:18:50 utc jmettraux hello !
2010-08-19 12:20:15 utc tosch_le did install 1.9.2-p0 some minutes before and had troubles with the rk specs: since '.' is missing in '$:' with 1.9.2, there are some issues
2010-08-19 12:20:27 utc jmettraux ok
2010-08-19 12:20:32 utc jmettraux you want to fix it ?
2010-08-19 12:20:39 utc jmettraux $:.unshift('.') ?
2010-08-19 12:21:31 utc jmettraux did you already fix it ?
2010-08-19 12:22:08 utc tosch_le i tried locally, but ran into errors with nokogiri
2010-08-19 12:22:21 utc jmettraux oh
2010-08-19 12:22:55 utc tosch_le i suppose some extension build went amoc
2010-08-19 12:24:57 utc tosch_le or rvm/bundler did some tricks with cached gems
2010-08-19 12:25:12 utc tosch_le trying with a clean install now
2010-08-19 12:37:04 utc tosch_le pushed
2010-08-19 12:39:47 utc jmettraux is it still possible to run a spec individually ?
2010-08-19 12:40:01 utc tosch_le i tried with success
2010-08-19 12:40:09 utc tosch_le ./spec is in $:
2010-08-19 12:41:36 utc jmettraux cool, great, works fine here as well
2010-08-19 12:42:07 utc jmettraux thanks !
2010-08-19 12:42:35 utc tosch_le :-)
2010-08-19 12:56:22 utc tosch_le have to leave now, summer party in the kindergarten :-)
2010-08-19 12:56:31 utc tosch_le bye!
2010-08-19 12:56:40 utc jmettraux ciao !
2010-08-19 14:12:46 utc jmettraux fixr: good morning !
2010-08-19 14:22:42 utc fixr jmettraux: hey John! So, the rumours were true, you don't sleep! :)
2010-08-19 14:22:52 utc jmettraux that's wrong !
2010-08-19 14:22:57 utc jmettraux I do sleep !
2010-08-19 14:23:22 utc fixr hehe I'm kidding! I read that somewhere on the group
2010-08-19 14:24:46 utc fixr the other users that show up in this channel are bots o real people?
2010-08-19 14:26:27 utc jmettraux only bots that I summoned to give the impression that people are using ruote
2010-08-19 14:26:37 utc jmettraux (sorry guys)
2010-08-19 14:38:24 utc fixr oh.. sorry for asking then, but I think it's ok, actually. Not that many people use IRC, but the google group is very active IMO
2010-08-19 14:38:47 utc jmettraux this month is quiet though
2010-08-19 14:39:16 utc jmettraux there is only one bot, it's "ruote_logger", it outputs to http://ruote.rubyforge.org/irclogs/
2010-08-19 14:41:06 utc jmettraux hello
2010-08-19 14:41:12 utc lbt hi
2010-08-19 14:41:36 utc lbt hi fixr
2010-08-19 14:42:17 utc anb_ I'm not a bot !
2010-08-19 14:42:21 utc anb_ :)
2010-08-19 14:42:40 utc anb_ ( that's exactly what a bot would say though )
2010-08-19 14:42:55 utc lbt fixr: we're using it Nokia and MeeGo FWIW... :)
2010-08-19 14:43:44 utc lbt BTW jmettraux, I have a team joining soon who I've asked to put together some .spec for performance testing
2010-08-19 14:44:06 utc jmettraux cool, which storage ?
2010-08-19 14:44:18 utc lbt well, we use filesystem now
2010-08-19 14:44:35 utc lbt but I would like them to put some simple load generators into ruote
2010-08-19 14:44:55 utc lbt and something to report on the resultant participant call rate
2010-08-19 14:44:56 utc jmettraux you'll be deceived
2010-08-19 14:45:09 utc jmettraux that's not the right word
2010-08-19 14:45:10 utc fixr lol, ok, that was very gullible of me. Hey guys!
2010-08-19 14:46:12 utc lbt jmettraux: I am expecting to measure rates at which workflows run
2010-08-19 14:46:12 utc jmettraux ruote's priority is on consistency, not performance
2010-08-19 14:46:35 utc lbt that's fine... we need to know it to understand how to resource it
2010-08-19 14:46:44 utc jmettraux OK
2010-08-19 14:47:02 utc lbt not interested in speed per se
2010-08-19 14:47:17 utc jmettraux :-)
2010-08-19 14:47:23 utc lbt more interested in understanding how much load it can handle in various situations
2010-08-19 14:47:45 utc lbt it may also help find regressions and inform DB selection
2010-08-19 14:47:56 utc lbt heck... we'll put the fs on an SSD ...
2010-08-19 14:48:05 utc lbt Intel make them ;)
2010-08-19 14:48:51 utc jmettraux cool
2010-08-19 14:48:59 utc lbt another area of interest is security...
2010-08-19 14:49:16 utc jmettraux I'm working on a golang implementation for storage, but it takes time
2010-08-19 14:49:22 utc jmettraux security is zero
2010-08-19 14:49:32 utc lbt yep... that's OK too
2010-08-19 14:49:52 utc jmettraux looking forward to the feedback anyway
2010-08-19 14:49:55 utc lbt understanding how to trust workitems and how to maybe allow point-2-point verification for participants
2010-08-19 14:50:24 utc lbt I considered just getting participants to sign workitems or something...
2010-08-19 14:50:39 utc lbt anyhow... we're doing an analysis of if/why it matters
2010-08-19 14:50:45 utc jmettraux there's nothing for that in amqp ?
2010-08-19 14:50:52 utc lbt not properly
2010-08-19 14:50:56 utc jmettraux ok
2010-08-19 14:51:02 utc lbt in the future...
2010-08-19 14:51:30 utc lbt also there are issues in doing that at the amqp level given the variety of language/library support
2010-08-19 14:51:43 utc jmettraux understood
2010-08-19 14:52:15 utc lbt something simple (but expensive) like gpg may be OK
2010-08-19 14:52:30 utc lbt really not too worried about the tech yet
2010-08-19 14:52:40 utc lbt want to understand the problem
2010-08-19 14:52:51 utc jmettraux your env is so insecure ?
2010-08-19 14:53:05 utc lbt we may make the ruote/boss a part of the publc SDK proceses
2010-08-19 14:53:12 utc jmettraux ouch
2010-08-19 14:53:13 utc lbt so publishing apps to app-stores
2010-08-19 14:53:22 utc jmettraux fun :-)
2010-08-19 14:53:50 utc lbt and we fully expect any MeeGo vendors to use ruote/boss as their process automation
2010-08-19 14:54:05 utc lbt I hope it works ;)
2010-08-19 14:54:31 utc jmettraux :-)
2010-08-19 14:54:57 utc jmettraux can you program in ruby for the MeeGo platform ?
2010-08-19 14:55:01 utc lbt I'll be doing a couple of presentations at the MeeGo conference in Nov. One will be aimed at vendors who want to build product on top of MeeGo
2010-08-19 14:55:15 utc lbt jmettraux: I'm setting up the public build systems
2010-08-19 14:55:34 utc lbt so that is where the community will provide tools not in core meego
2010-08-19 14:55:44 utc lbt there's a guy called ccooke
2010-08-19 14:55:57 utc lbt who may be the ruby maintainer for meego-community
2010-08-19 14:56:01 utc lbt I'm working on him
2010-08-19 14:56:45 utc lbt part of the problem is that the meego crowd are firm 'distro' people.... and ruby... not so much a 'distro-friendly' language :)
2010-08-19 14:57:13 utc jmettraux aah
2010-08-19 14:57:49 utc lbt we'll find a way... opensuse has a simple gem->rpm system.
2010-08-19 14:58:31 utc lbt plus... ruby isn't really the language of choice for a mobile device
2010-08-19 14:58:58 utc lbt OTOH ... it may have a place in the web side on set-top-boxes etc
2010-08-19 15:01:33 utc lbt change of subject
2010-08-19 15:01:53 utc jmettraux ok, thanks for the explanation
2010-08-19 15:02:05 utc lbt have you any slides/notes/tricks/spreadsheets that you use to sketch/draft processes for ruote?
2010-08-19 15:03:57 utc jmettraux sorry, nothing
2010-08-19 15:04:09 utc jmettraux fixr: do you have something ?
2010-08-19 15:04:39 utc jmettraux I'm just listening to the "customer" and then deriving the process
2010-08-19 15:06:17 utc lbt sure np ... we're just getting used to it; we'll do some sketches to illustrate and explore
2010-08-19 15:08:06 utc fixr yes, I may have something; it's a spreadsheet we use. It's a little bit specialized, but it might help
2010-08-19 15:10:46 utc fixr and by specialized, I mean we use a lot of custom params attached to the defitions.. for instance, a participant might set :activity => "Fill some data", :is_visible => true (to make the data public to everyone), and such
2010-08-19 15:11:07 utc fixr these are of course read by our implementation
2010-08-19 15:11:56 utc fixr and we use the spreadsheet to take note of them
2010-08-19 15:12:28 utc fixr I don't have it here, but I'm asking for it ;)
2010-08-19 15:12:34 utc jmettraux sounds nice
2010-08-19 15:15:25 utc jmettraux OK, bedtime, ciao a tutti !
2010-08-19 15:21:04 utc lbt fixr: cool, thanks
2010-08-19 15:21:19 utc lbt fixr: FYI: http://wiki.meego.com/Release_Infrastructure/BOSS
2010-08-19 15:23:54 utc fixr lbt: nice. When you said you were using ruote for Meego, I was wondering how exactly
2010-08-19 15:24:08 utc fixr lbt: one thing, though... what's OBS?
2010-08-19 15:24:20 utc lbt open build system
2010-08-19 15:24:33 utc lbt takes src tarballs and produces .rpm/.deb
2010-08-19 15:25:17 utc lbt http://wiki.meego.com/Build_Infrastructure
2010-08-19 15:25:34 utc fixr interesting
2010-08-19 15:26:01 utc lbt http://wiki.meego.com/Release_Infrastructure/BOSS/Design may be of interest too .. how we use amqp
2010-08-19 15:26:20 utc fixr MeeGo is open source?
2010-08-19 15:27:30 utc fixr it is. I just read the wikipedia :)
2010-08-19 15:27:34 utc fixr doing my research
2010-08-19 15:29:12 utc fixr just gave me another reason to replace my dying N95 with a N900
2010-08-19 15:30:26 utc lbt yep... it's as linux/OSS friendly as it gets
2010-08-19 15:30:38 utc lbt not perfect ..... yet :)
2010-08-19 15:30:56 utc lbt chat on #meego (and #maemo for N900 as shipped)
2010-08-19 23:10:59 utc fixr anyone around?
2010-08-19 23:35:04 utc fixr hehe
2010-08-19 23:35:28 utc fixr sorry to bother you this early, I have a few questions
2010-08-19 23:35:40 utc jmettraux please
2010-08-19 23:36:28 utc fixr as you may remember, I'm migrating to 2.1... however, I'm undecided if I should take the ruote way alone, or use ruote-kit
2010-08-19 23:37:05 utc fixr the thing about rk is that I'm on rails-2.1, and it doesn't support middlewares
2010-08-19 23:37:14 utc fixr but I read about ruote-kit-client
2010-08-19 23:37:27 utc fixr however... is that still being mantained?
2010-08-19 23:37:42 utc jmettraux tosch_le wants to update it
2010-08-19 23:38:34 utc fixr as of now, it isn't usable? I haven't tested it yet
2010-08-19 23:38:39 utc jmettraux there is a trick with ruote 2.1.x
2010-08-19 23:39:01 utc jmettraux you can do engine = Ruote::Engine.new(storage)
2010-08-19 23:39:16 utc jmettraux the engine is a pure "dashboard"
2010-08-19 23:39:27 utc jmettraux and have the worker somewhere else
2010-08-19 23:39:59 utc jmettraux you can separate the worker(s) from the engine(s)
2010-08-19 23:40:16 utc fixr I see
2010-08-19 23:40:23 utc jmettraux so you could use ruote-kit with a worker and have your app share the same storage, but with no worker
2010-08-19 23:40:54 utc jmettraux so you get the ruote-kit web-console and your rails 2.1 app
2010-08-19 23:42:06 utc fixr would that play nice on a multi process environment? We use mongrel_cluster, and ruote 0.9.x didn't play nice with threads. That's actually the one reason we're migrating ;)
2010-08-19 23:42:25 utc jmettraux you should test
2010-08-19 23:42:33 utc jmettraux ruote 2.1 is much simplified
2010-08-19 23:42:57 utc jmettraux no more separate thread for scheduling
2010-08-19 23:43:37 utc fixr that I read on your post for ruote 2.1, but just wanted to check :)
2010-08-19 23:44:13 utc fixr I will test it anyways
2010-08-19 23:46:10 utc fixr rails 2.1 is very old now, a pain in the ass. Unfortunately we are stuck with it for a while
2010-08-19 23:46:49 utc fixr I have to work around it somehow, that's what I liked about ruote-kit, it sits behind
2010-08-19 23:54:55 utc jmettraux :-)
2010-08-20 00:07:53 utc fixr ruote 2.1 no longer depends on the rufus gems? like treechecker, for instance
2010-08-20 00:08:02 utc jmettraux yes it does
2010-08-20 00:08:21 utc fixr scheduler being the only one that's not?
2010-08-20 00:08:40 utc jmettraux http://github.com/jmettraux/ruote/blob/ruote2.1/Rakefile#L36-41
2010-08-20 00:08:58 utc jmettraux I could almost drop the dependency on rufus-scheduler
2010-08-20 00:09:22 utc jmettraux not using the scheduler itself but only some of its utility methods
2010-08-20 00:10:25 utc fixr oh, right